Interview: Caleb and Livvie from Captive in the Dark & Seduced in the Dark

Lisa asks, "Jen, Kris would you like a refill on your wine?" Kristie shouts, "Um, yes please, this is going to be a hard interview- imagine hating the person who kidnapped you and at the same time being attracted to him and to WANT him to touch you, hold you, - to have your body betray you because it wants him! Geez, I need to loosen up a bit, fill it to the top. Thanks Lisa."  Jen simply nods her head yes and asks, "We still have a few minutes before they call. Do you know where they are?" "I think they’re somewhere in Spain, I can't be positive though," Lisa says. The computer comes to life. "You ladies ready for this?” Kristie asks, while Lisa clicks to answer. Caleb and Livvie appear on the screen.  They are both gorgeous. Kristie and Lisa stare at the screen lost in thought, Jen clears her throat." Umm hmm, Caleb, Livvie thank you so much for chatting with us today. I'm Jen, this is Lisa and Kristie, we're the Three Chicks.” "We know this can't be easy for either of you, we greatly appreciate you telling us what you can," Kristie says, with a remorseful look on her face. “Are you ready to begin?" Lisa asks. Both Caleb and Livvie say yes.....Lisa continues, “I think answering these questions will help us, as well as other people understand your story better. And for those who do not know your story-give them a little insight into your life.."

Three Chicks:  Livvie, how you can love this man, let alone forgive him?
 
Livvie:  Oh! That’s question number one? I’m gonna need a drink for this…or twenty. It’s a difficult question and one that has a complicated answer. However, the simplest way to answer it is to say that I can’t stand the alternative. If I were unable to forgive him, I’d hate him. If I allowed myself to hate him, it would consume me as a person. And as for loving him, it’s nothing I ever expected. It happened.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, why risk your life for this girl-what is it about her that made you willing to lose everything? (even if you hated the life you were living) Why risk it all for this one person- why her?

Caleb: I think it’s the way Livvie says. I didn’t plan on having feelings for her. In fact, I didn’t understand my feelings once I had them. I struggled against it, but in the end I think I was just taken by her spirit, her resilience, and her capacity for forgiveness. It also helps that she’s beautiful and fucking hilarious. Granted, I was in a strange place in my own life when we met. I was having a lot internal struggles that had nothing to do with her. For whatever reason, the timing of two people like us finding each other, even in horrible circumstances, was just right…it was fate. Or something like that.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, you have kidnapped a lot of girls prior to Livvie. Why was she so different from your past captives?

Caleb:  Okay, let me set the record straight on this once and for all. I’m a shitty person. I’ve done a lot of shitty things, but Livvie was the first person I ever kidnapped. She wrote about it in the very beginning. Allow me to read the following:
"As a slave trainer, he had trained at least a score of girls. Some were willing, offering themselves as pleasure slaves to escape destitution, sacrificing freedom for security. Others came to him as the coerced daughters of impoverished farmers looking to off load their burden in exchange for a dowry. Some were the fourth or fifth wives of sheikhs and bankers sent by their husbands to learn to satisfy their distinct appetites. But this particular slave, the one he eyed from across the busy street—she was different. She was neither willing, nor coerced, nor sent to him. She was pure conquest."
In a lot of ways, the fact I actually kidnapped her is what made her so different to begin with. I was doing EXACTLY what had been done to me and that’s why I was so ate up about what was going on. I was willing to do it, but I was never fully at ease with it.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, it seems you developed a strange bond with Caleb from the beginning,  especially after Jair came into the room you were held. Although Caleb said he wouldn't hurt you, why did you trust him?

Livvie: I wouldn’t say that I trusted him. I’d kicked him in the nuts and punched him at the first opportunity. However, that said, he didn’t seem like he was set on raping or killing me. If he’d wanted to, he’d had plenty of opportunity.  That wasn’t the case with Jair. He was pretty clear about his intentions to do all sorts of things to me. My choices were bad and worse. I went with bad.
 
Three Chicks:  Caleb, you fought with yourself mentally in regards to Livvie. From the start was it hard on you mentally- to treat her like a nobody, to train her to be a sex slave?

Caleb: Yes. As I said, all new circumstances for the both of us.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, after your whipping, did you realize that Caleb meant business?

Livvie: Wow! These questions are pretty personal and intense. But I guess when you put yourself out there, that’s what you can expect. The short answer is yes, I did.

Three Chicks: Caleb, after you punished Livvie, you got lost in thoughts about "love and loving a woman long term"- did Livvie awaken this feeling in you?

Caleb: Yes and no. My adolescent life was obviously different than a lot of normal boys. Women were…confusing for me. I had a lot to figure out about my sexuality. Most of my life revolved around sex and violence. That’s what I knew and understood. After a while, it was only natural that I would be curious about love and what it was about. The seed had been planted, but it took a lot for it to grow.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, how did it make you feel to be attracted to Caleb, to have to depend on him?  How did it feel to enjoy the way he made your body respond in spite of yourself?

Livvie: It made me feel a lot of things. I’d been attracted to him before I knew who and what he was. I disliked him as a person once I learned the truth, but as time went on and…well, it’s difficult to explain. Some people will say it’s Stockholm Syndrome no matter how much I negate it. Others will say it was my way of coping.  Both are perhaps partially correct, for me, I think…shit – Can I just say he’s talented and leave it at that? I like that much better.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, did you beat and rape your past captives?

Caleb: There’s a line and I think you just crossed it.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, what was going through your mind when you escaped Caleb?
 
Livvie: Getting away mostly. *Laughs uncomfortably*

Three Chicks:  Caleb, how do you forgive yourself for the life you've led and the lives you've ruined?

Caleb: Who said I did?

Three Chicks:  Livvie, when the bikers had you, beat you then tried to rape you (we cringe when asking that question), did you wish you were back with Caleb?

Caleb: I’ll take this one, pet. Next fucking question…watch the line.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, when you found Livvie again, beaten, what did you feel and what would you have done had she been raped?

Caleb: Don’t you think I did enough? Trust me, that’s a side of me that best remains talked about in works of fiction.
 
Three Chicks:  Livvie, how did you feel when Caleb first called you by your name?

Livvie: *Clears throat* Um...I felt…real. I don’t know if that makes sense. I felt like a person and I think by then, I knew Caleb meant something by it. He rarely says things flippantly.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, how frustrating and difficult was it for you to talk to the FBI, especially Agent Reed? What was it about him that reminded you of Caleb?

Livvie: Reed? Ha! You’re really pushing all of Caleb’s buttons tonight, aren’t you? Well, Reed is…he’s…meticulous. He has a messed up sense of humor and…hesnotbadtolookatorabadkisser. Okay, enough of that.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, when did you realize you were in love with Livvie?
 
Caleb: *Glares at Livvie* You’re going to ask me that after she just said another man was attractive and a good kisser? *Turns to Livvie* You’re not fooling anyone with all that fast talking by the way. I heard you. I’m sitting right here and I heard you. *To the camera* Long before I knew what the hell to call it.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, when you were at Felipe’s house and saw the things going on did the reality set in that you were looking at your future?

Livvie: Um, I feel like I covered my feelings pretty well in the book. In all honesty, I’m not quite comfortable discussing that chapter of my life in great depth. It happened. I lived. We lived.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, why did it take Kid and Livvie "performing" to make you realize how much you cared and wanted to be with her?

Caleb: *Scowls* Next. Question.

Three Chicks:  Are you both happy with your lives as they are right now?

Livvie: We’re pretty much like everyone else. We have good days and bad ones, but I’d say we have more great days than not. I’m very happy. I have someone who loves me, protects me, and *blushes* is amazing in the bedroom. I can’t complain and don’t want to.

Caleb: *Grins* I’m happier than I have a right to be. Aside from your invasive questions that is.
 
Three Chicks:  Any plans to return to the States?
 
Livvie: We couldn’t tell you if we did. *Winks*

Three Chicks:  Livvie, you knew Caleb cared for you, even loved you although he didn't say it. How did it make you feel when he finally told you that he did love you?

Livvie: *Deep sigh* That’s kind of a complicated question. Caleb and I are both prideful people and I didn’t really take his hesitation well in the beginning. *Goes quiet and looks toward Caleb*

Caleb: She made me sweat it out for a long time. I’m writing about it right now and when Epilogue: The Dark Duet is finally released you’ll get to learn what the hell I went through with this one. She wrapped it up nicely in Seduced in the Dark, but she left out quite a bit of story. I told her I loved her before that night, but it was definitely a special moment when we could finally say it to each other without…well, you’ll read.

Three Chicks:  What song would you choose to describe your lives now?

Livvie: Oh, gosh, I don’t even know. Let me think…………..*ducks head and looks at Caleb who is rolling his eyes* He hates this! But whenever Selena Gomez’s song, “Love You Like a Love Song” comes on in the car, I sing it to him.

Caleb: I hate you for telling them. *Smiles* I don’t have a song to describe our relationship. Because I’m a man. Next question.

Three Chicks:  Caleb, did reading Livvie's book help you in any way?

Caleb: I actually write about this in Epilogue: The Dark Duet. It was a pretty shitty day when I found out she was writing about us, but after a while I think it helped us both. Honestly, if feels like so long ago now, I kind of wish we could just forget about it, but that’s not going to happen.

Three Chicks:  Livvie, was writing your story therapeutic? Do you still talk with Agent Sloan?

Livvie: I have to admit I don’t talk to Sloan anymore. It’s too much of a risk. Reed has made…certain allowances for me, but I don’t like to push him. It’s sort of a tenuous truce.
 
Three Chicks:  This question is for the both of you.  It must be difficult to make any long term plans, do you have any long term goals in mind?

Livvie: It can be, but I don’t think we’re different from everyone else. We take things one day at a time and see where it takes us. We’re still young…well, I am. Ha! Plenty of time to make life’s big decisions.

Caleb: Making Livvie happy is more difficult than she let’s on. For now, I think that’s enough. I plan on keeping her to myself for as long as I possibly can. I’m selfish that way.
 
Livvie: Me? I’m difficult? Jerkface. You’re the one who’s difficult.

Caleb: *Smirks* I never said I wasn’t. I just mentioned that you definitely are.
 
Livvie: I hate you.

Caleb: No, you wish you did. *Leans over and kisses Livvie*


"Thank you for setting aside some time to chat with us. You both have been through so much and it's inspirational to see you overcome all that you’ve lived through,"Jen says, in awe of them.
Kristie nods in agreement and says, "You both are two of the bravest, strongest people I know."
Lisa smiles and says, "We wish you nothing but success and happiness in your future, just remember to take things one day at a time."
 
Livvie and Caleb smile and thank us and we end our Skype call. Jennifer looks to both Lisa and Kristie and says, "Wow, that was really intense and horrific and yet it was beautiful at the same time."  

"Yeah, I can't imagine the things they’ve suffered through," Lisa says. “I’m happy for them, they seem to be healing, and they obviously love each other. They have a bond I don’t think we’ll ever fully understand," Kristie says, while staring at her wine. Lisa looks at us, "Maybe we can catch up with them again in a couple of years.” “Sounds good to me”, both Kristie and Jennifer say at the same time... “In the meantime, let's finish this bottle of wine, come on ladies."